Post by isaiah on Nov 26, 2008 22:17:29 GMT -5
From: joie (Original Message) Sent: 8/31/2005 12:27 AM
~ Robbed Churches? ~
What was Paul speaking of in 11Cor. 11:8? 2Cor 11:7 Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely? 11:8 I robbed other churches, taking wages of them, to do you service.
Paul is showing here that taking wages of a church, was considered robbing them. But why did he do this thing? Was it for himself? No. He said he took from them in order to do service to the Corinthian church. Paul was not taking these wages for himself. He was using the money, [if it was money], to help others. Every time it is mentioned that Paul received any such thing, he said it was for the help of poor saints.
But notice that he also considered this to be the same as robbery. It was only showing and teaching that when a man does receive wages for feeding the flock of God, they are committing robbery. Paul had to do these things in order to teach us the full truth of all spiritual matters. Paul knew he was not doing this thing for his own profit, so he could do it as a teacher. He was using the things other churches gave to him for the help of those in need. He makes it very clear that he labored day and night with his own hands to supply his needs and also the needs of any who worked with him. So Paul is not going against this principal here and taking wages for himself. He did no such thing. He only took from those who were prospering at the time, to help those in need, for this is the principal of the NT Church of God. They had all things in common. It was an equality. This is the very heart of true Christianity.
When some receive more than others and do not share, it is not the true Christianity. When a paid preacher lives so lavish, as many do, while his people lack, this is of Satan.
2Cor 11:9 And when I was present with you, and wanted, I was chargeable to no man: for that which was lacking to me the brethren which came from Macedonia supplied: and in all things I have kept myself from being burdensome unto you, and so will I keep myself.
Paul was living by faith as he taught others to do. When he had need, other Christians were helping him. He did not go into a church and ask for help. It came about by pure faith. God had moved on the ones who did help him. It is not wrong to allow Christians to help you. It is wrong to work for a salary in the ministry. This is not faith, and it is not equality, so it is not Christian.
2Cor 11:12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we. 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
Notice, something astounding here. Paul is saying that he lived this way to cut off occasion from those who desired occasion. They wished to glory in what they received for their ministry. But he said they should be found even as Paul was. But now look at what he said about these people: They are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
This is a big statement! It is saying that the men who lifted themselves up to take wages from the churches, because they ‘ministered’ to them are actually false apostles, deceitful workers, and they are only transforming themselves as apostles of Christ.
He said as Satan transforms himself as an angel of light, so his ministers transform themselves as ministers of righteousness. But he said their end will be according to their works, which is taking wages from the churches. So in the end, they will be burned up. They have sawn to the flesh, so the will of the flesh, reap corruption.
2Cor 11:16 I say again, Let no man think me a fool; if otherwise, yet as a fool receive me, that I may boast myself a little. 11:17 That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord, but as it were foolishly, in this confidence of boasting. 11:18 Seeing that many glory after the flesh, I will glory also. 11:19 For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise. 11:20 For ye suffer, if a man bring you into bondage, if a man devour you, if a man take of you, if a man exalt himself, if a man smite you on the face.
Now notice here that Paul said he is going to act as a fool for a while to show them how foolish the things of these people are. They are boasters. So they are fools. They glory after the flesh, so they are fools. When churches glory in how large their group is, how fancy their building is, how much money they take in, etc, they are glorying after the flesh. So they are fools. This is what Paul is teaching here.
But notice the real whammy. He said they accept fools gladly, so he mocks them by saying for you are ‘wise’. He said they allow it or accept it [suffer] if a man bring you into bondage--- in other words, back under law..... if a man devour you -- in other words, taking from them and teaching them false doctrine, IF A MAN TAKE OF YOU....this is the false apostles taking wages of the churches for THEMSELVES. They are taking from those very people they ‘claim’ to be caring for by feeding them the Word of God. But in actuality, they are only seeking for their money. These people can exalt themselves and even smite the people and take from them, and they will just glory in these false teachers.
But Paul said yet I have preached the Word of God to you FREELY and you act as though I have offended you. Then he goes on to tell them the many things he has suffered for the Word of God. He said if I glory after these things, it is as a fool. Yet you pay men to come in and deceive you and suffer him gladly. So it is today.
People, Paul is not going to say in every other Scripture that it is wrong to take money or pay for doing the work of God, and then turn right around and take wages of churches for himself! He did no such thing! Paul did not cross what the Prophets of old had said. He did not cross what Jesus had taught. They said come buy and drink milk of the Word, without price and without money. Paul is not going against that here. The Word of God is not in conflict with itself. Paul clearly showed here that when men take of the people they are supposed to be feeding or ministering to, that they are FALSE APOSTLES, Satan’s ministers transforming themselves as ministers of Christ.
This chapter is the most clear of them all saying it is WRONG TO TAKE PAY FOR DOING THE WORK OF THE MINISTRY! AMEN. Only Satan’s ministers take pay for their ‘labour’.
By: Jo smith
8-30-05
~ Robbed Churches? ~
What was Paul speaking of in 11Cor. 11:8? 2Cor 11:7 Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely? 11:8 I robbed other churches, taking wages of them, to do you service.
Paul is showing here that taking wages of a church, was considered robbing them. But why did he do this thing? Was it for himself? No. He said he took from them in order to do service to the Corinthian church. Paul was not taking these wages for himself. He was using the money, [if it was money], to help others. Every time it is mentioned that Paul received any such thing, he said it was for the help of poor saints.
But notice that he also considered this to be the same as robbery. It was only showing and teaching that when a man does receive wages for feeding the flock of God, they are committing robbery. Paul had to do these things in order to teach us the full truth of all spiritual matters. Paul knew he was not doing this thing for his own profit, so he could do it as a teacher. He was using the things other churches gave to him for the help of those in need. He makes it very clear that he labored day and night with his own hands to supply his needs and also the needs of any who worked with him. So Paul is not going against this principal here and taking wages for himself. He did no such thing. He only took from those who were prospering at the time, to help those in need, for this is the principal of the NT Church of God. They had all things in common. It was an equality. This is the very heart of true Christianity.
When some receive more than others and do not share, it is not the true Christianity. When a paid preacher lives so lavish, as many do, while his people lack, this is of Satan.
2Cor 11:9 And when I was present with you, and wanted, I was chargeable to no man: for that which was lacking to me the brethren which came from Macedonia supplied: and in all things I have kept myself from being burdensome unto you, and so will I keep myself.
Paul was living by faith as he taught others to do. When he had need, other Christians were helping him. He did not go into a church and ask for help. It came about by pure faith. God had moved on the ones who did help him. It is not wrong to allow Christians to help you. It is wrong to work for a salary in the ministry. This is not faith, and it is not equality, so it is not Christian.
2Cor 11:12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we. 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.
Notice, something astounding here. Paul is saying that he lived this way to cut off occasion from those who desired occasion. They wished to glory in what they received for their ministry. But he said they should be found even as Paul was. But now look at what he said about these people: They are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
This is a big statement! It is saying that the men who lifted themselves up to take wages from the churches, because they ‘ministered’ to them are actually false apostles, deceitful workers, and they are only transforming themselves as apostles of Christ.
He said as Satan transforms himself as an angel of light, so his ministers transform themselves as ministers of righteousness. But he said their end will be according to their works, which is taking wages from the churches. So in the end, they will be burned up. They have sawn to the flesh, so the will of the flesh, reap corruption.
2Cor 11:16 I say again, Let no man think me a fool; if otherwise, yet as a fool receive me, that I may boast myself a little. 11:17 That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord, but as it were foolishly, in this confidence of boasting. 11:18 Seeing that many glory after the flesh, I will glory also. 11:19 For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise. 11:20 For ye suffer, if a man bring you into bondage, if a man devour you, if a man take of you, if a man exalt himself, if a man smite you on the face.
Now notice here that Paul said he is going to act as a fool for a while to show them how foolish the things of these people are. They are boasters. So they are fools. They glory after the flesh, so they are fools. When churches glory in how large their group is, how fancy their building is, how much money they take in, etc, they are glorying after the flesh. So they are fools. This is what Paul is teaching here.
But notice the real whammy. He said they accept fools gladly, so he mocks them by saying for you are ‘wise’. He said they allow it or accept it [suffer] if a man bring you into bondage--- in other words, back under law..... if a man devour you -- in other words, taking from them and teaching them false doctrine, IF A MAN TAKE OF YOU....this is the false apostles taking wages of the churches for THEMSELVES. They are taking from those very people they ‘claim’ to be caring for by feeding them the Word of God. But in actuality, they are only seeking for their money. These people can exalt themselves and even smite the people and take from them, and they will just glory in these false teachers.
But Paul said yet I have preached the Word of God to you FREELY and you act as though I have offended you. Then he goes on to tell them the many things he has suffered for the Word of God. He said if I glory after these things, it is as a fool. Yet you pay men to come in and deceive you and suffer him gladly. So it is today.
People, Paul is not going to say in every other Scripture that it is wrong to take money or pay for doing the work of God, and then turn right around and take wages of churches for himself! He did no such thing! Paul did not cross what the Prophets of old had said. He did not cross what Jesus had taught. They said come buy and drink milk of the Word, without price and without money. Paul is not going against that here. The Word of God is not in conflict with itself. Paul clearly showed here that when men take of the people they are supposed to be feeding or ministering to, that they are FALSE APOSTLES, Satan’s ministers transforming themselves as ministers of Christ.
This chapter is the most clear of them all saying it is WRONG TO TAKE PAY FOR DOING THE WORK OF THE MINISTRY! AMEN. Only Satan’s ministers take pay for their ‘labour’.
By: Jo smith
8-30-05